Monday's New Day on CNN featured a debate between CNN law enforcement analyst Harry Houck and former Clinton administration official Ana Maria Salazar over the shooting death of a woman in San Francisco, Kate Steinle, by an illegal immigrant -- a repeat offender who had been previously released by city police rather than sent away for deportation due to the city's "sanctuary" policy on illegal immigrants.
Houck blamed San Francisco's "stupid sanctuary law" and the politicians who supported it as being responsible for Steinle's death. Houck:
This woman would be alive today if they did not have this stupid sanctuary law in that crazy city of San Francisco. I blame not only the shooter, but also the responsibility has to lie on those politicians who implemented that insane law. The Immigration wanted him back after they turned him in, and there's no way they can say they didn't know what his record was because every time somebody is arrested, they do a ... background investigation on that guy... And they'll find out about every conviction and every single time that he was deported back to Mexico.
As Salazar repeatedly tried to change the subject from immigrants who commit crimes to the general issue of whether immigrants have a higher or lower crime rate than the American-born population, with the former Clinton official at one point trying to inject Donald Trump into the discussion, the former NYPD detective called out her evasiveness:
Are you going to steal the whole show here with your bureaucratic rhetoric coming from somewhere out in Washington, D.C.? The fact is, you know, right, you're the one who automatically injects all other Mexicans into this specific conversation. And that's not what we're talking about. We are talking about criminals like this man, all right, who's got a criminal record, and Americans should start getting very upset about this, we have the death of an innocent young girl, a guy who was deported five times who never even should have made his way back here, all right?
He then implicated President Obama as he added:
So why doesn't Obama have those borders closed so this guy can't make it back here? And let me tell you something else. The Mexican government doesn't give a damn about anybody we deport. If they did they would also close the borders on their side. And they are doing absolutely nothing. That's why thousands of people come into this country every year.
After Salazar asserted that illegal immigration has diminished under President Obama, Houck took another jab: "Like I believe anything coming from the Obama administration who's been caught lying several times already."
Below is a complete transcript of the segment from the Monday, July 6, New Day on CNN from about 6:45 a.m.:
MICHAELA PEREIRA: That is Francisco Sanchez admitting on camera to CNN affiliate KGO that he shot and killed a 32-year-old woman -- Kate Steinle -- on a San Francisco pier. The murder of this young woman is reigniting the debate on illegal immigration. Sanchez had been reported -- deported, rather, pardon me -- five times, seven prior felony convictions, including four for drugs. So why was he let out of jail and back on the streets of San Francisco?
Let's bring in Ana Maria Salazar. She is a Latin American political analyst and policy advisor to President Clinton. Also with us this morning, Harry Houck, CNN law enforcement analyst and retired New York City police detective. ... Harry, we know that San Francisco released him and there's been some conversation about why they would have let him back out on the streets. You're putting the blame squarely on the "sanctuary city" policy that San Francisco has.
HARRY HOUCK, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Exactly, Michaela. This woman would be alive today if they did not have this stupid sanctuary law in that crazy city of San Francisco. I blame not only the shooter, but also the responsibility has to lie on those politicians who implemented that insane law. The Immigration wanted him back after they turned him in, and there's no way they can say they didn't know what his record was because every time somebody is arrested, they do a criminal investigation, a background investigation on that guy, what we call is a BCI check or a triple I check in New York. And they'll find out about every conviction and every single time that he was deported back to Mexico.
PEREIRA: All right, Ana Maria, have at him. I know you're chomping at the bit to respond.
ANA MARIA SALAZAR, FORMER CLINTON ADMINISTRATION OFFICIAL: Well, I have to tell you, Michaela, before we go further, I was a policy advisor for the Special Envoy of the Americas at the White House. But I was also the Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense, which implied resources to train and support law enforcement not only in Mexico, but around the world. And what I know about law enforcement, it means you have to give priorities. And these priorities sometimes have to do with making difficult choices.
I totally disagree with what he says, what Harry says. because all the data shows that migrants either who have documents or undocumented that come to the United States have lower crime rates. And, yes, maybe this horrible situation and where we have this man who was deported five times came back to the United States. It kind of raises the issue of, if most of the drug cases are federal cases, why did he come back? I mean, I think there's a question to ask, why wasn't he kept in jail?
And what I did, when I was both at the Pentagon and working at the State Department, we tried to negotiate with Mexico some kind of mechanism by which the Mexicans would know who was being deported back to the United States. And I can almost bet on this, that when he was deported back to Mexico, the Mexican government did not know who this man was. Now, all of this does not erase this horrible tragedy where this woman dies and where you have a very difficult immigration debate that is being fueled by Donald Trump's hate language against Mexicans because this is not only migrants, this language is against Mexicans, Mexican-Americans who are living either legally or illegally in the United States. And when you use this type of hate language, and then you have these types of cases, makes it impossible to have a sane debate as to what should be U.S. policy towards Mexico and U.S. policy towards the, what, 11 million people who live in the United States, Mexicans who live illegally in the United States..
PEREIRA: Let me look a little deeper.
HOUCK: We're going off the subject.
SALAZAR: ...but you sure cannot say it was this policy per se that resulted in the death-
HOUCK: Can I speak, please?
SALAZAR: -of this woman. It's wrong, and you know it's wrong.
HOUCK: Are you going to steal the whole show here with your bureaucratic rhetoric coming from somewhere out in Washington, D.C.?
PEREIRA: Harry, go ahead and speak, but let's try to do this civilly.
HOUCK: The fact is, you know, right, you;'r e the one who automatically injects all other Mexicans into this specific conversation. And that's not what we're talking about. We are talking about criminals like this man, all right, who's got a criminal record, and Americans should start getting very upset about this, we have the death of an innocent young girl, a guy who was deported five times who never even should have made his way back here, all right? So why doesn't Obama have those borders closed so this guy can't make it back here? And let me tell you something else. The Mexican government doesn't give a damn about anybody we deport. If they did they would also close the borders on their side.
SALAZAR: That's not true. That is not true!
HOUCK: And they are doing absolutely nothing. That's why thousands of people come into this country every year.
SALAZAR: That is not true.
HOUCK: That's more political bureaucratic crap coming from people.
PEREIRA: Go ahead. Final comment from you.
SALAZAR: If you had your numbers right, you would know the number of Mexicans that are crossing the border has dramatically decreased during the Obama administration. Two, if you knew your information and you understand the immigration process and the borders-
HOUCK: Yeah, right.
SALAZAR: -which apparently you don't, you would understand that most-
HOUCK: Like I believe anything coming from the Obama administration who's been caught lying several times already
SALAZAR: -of the undocumented Central Americans that are trying to go into the United States are being detained by the Mexican government. And three, look at your numbers.
HOUCK: Yeah, right. The Mexican government wants the money going back to Mexico, is what they want.
PEREIRA: Harry, let her finish.
SALAZAR: -migrants who come through undocumented that come into the United States have a much lower crime rate than the rest of the population in the United States. That is the truth. Now, should there be a debate-
HOUCK: I'm talking about criminals, Madame. Criminals. Which you don't care about.
SALAZAR: -as to what should happen to these 11 million people. I think it's very important. I think there should be a debate.
PEREIRA: All right, I think I'm going to have to end this here. Ana Maria Salazar, thank you for bringing your passion. Harry Houck, we always know you've got a strong voice in a conversation like this. Both of you, thank you. This is very indicative, Alison, of the strong feelings that there are in this very controversial conversation.
