This past week, several MSNBC hosts pushed a sore loser narrative that the Republican House majority was won because of "rigged" congressional districts, with one host even claiming Republicans had been "cheating basically."
After Joe Scarborough first started pushing the "rigged" election line on Tuesday by invoking gerrymandering, fellow hosts Nicolle Wallace, Lawrence O'Donnell and Chris Hayes joined him on Wednesday after outgoing Democrat Congressman Wiley Nickel published an op-ed in The News & Observer complaining about North Carolina Republicans redrawing his home state's districts, and Jonathan Capehart jumped in on Friday night.
And, even though Republicans are heavily short-changed by California's district maps, O'Donnell spoke of the liberal state as if it were a model for how districts should be drawn.
On Wednesday, as Morning Joe covered the issue for a second day, co-host Mika Brzezinski plugged the segment: "Coming up, one Democratic member of Congress says that Republicans in his state threw fairness out the window, and it cost his party control of the House. Democratic Congressman Wiley Nickel joins us next to explain."
After a commercial break, Brzezinski dutifully promoted the Democrat spin on why the party lost: "Meanwhile, a growing number of Democrats are pointing to the congressional map in North Carolina as a key reason they could not wrestle back control of the House." She then read from Congressman Nickel's piece in which he hyper-focused on North Carolina's newly drawn districts costing Democrats three seats even though Republicans lost a couple of seats when courts recently forced the redrawing of districts in Alabama and Louisiana, handing Democrats two safe seats.
As Scarborough again used the word "rigged" to refer to Republicans making changes in North Carolina, he merely referred to it as a "snafu" when Democrats tried to aggressively gerrymander their state's districts in 2022, which backfired on them when a court intervened.
Appearing as a guest, Congressman Nickel asserted that "Republicans do it much more than Democrats."
Later the same day on MSNBC's The Last Word, O'Donnell also had the Democrat congressman on, and the MSNBC host lauded the process used by California: "... this is the kind of thing that cannot happen in California, for example, the state with the most congressional districts, because they have taken redistricting out of politics and given it to an independent body to do it."
But, even though a nonpartisan commission draws the districts in California, there were only seven out of 52 districts that voted Republican in the 2020 presidential election even though 34 percent of the state's voters voted for Donald Trump, which would have been equivalent to 18 districts. In 2024, Trump won 38 percent, the equivalent of 20 districts, but only nine districts were won by Republicans while 43 were won by Democrats.
The truth is there are plenty of states where the number of safe districts each party has is out of proportion to the state's overall voting pattern, and there are about as many cases of Republicans being short-changed as there are Democrats.
As Wallace anchored Deadline: White House, she declared that gerrymandering is "cheating basically," and had on liberal redistricting activist Marc Elias who similarly pushed the line that Republicans are worse about gerrymandering than Democrats, and cited California as an example to emulate.
It should be noted that before California started using a commission in 2012, the number of Republicans in the state's congressional delegation had not dropped below 19 out of 53 within the previous decade, which kept the proportion that each party held consistent with statewide popular vote totals. But, for next year's Congress, the number of Republicans will stand at just nine out of 52.
Transcripts follow:
MSNBC's Morning Joe
December 4, 2024
9:23 a.m. Eastern
MIKA BRZEZINSKI (before commercial break): Coming up, one Democratic member of Congress says that Republicans in his state threw fairness out the window, and it cost his party control of the House. Democratic Congressman Wiley Nickel joins us next to explain.
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Meanwhile, a growing number of Democrats are pointing to the congressional map in North Carolina as a key reason they could not wrestle back control of the House. In a new op-ed for The News & Observer, Democratic Congressman Wiley Nickel of North Carolina writes in part this:
North Carolina is a state of balance, a true purple state. With our nearly 50-50 split between Democrats and Republicans, North Carolinians expect fairness when it comes to how their voices are represented in Congress. But the Republican-controlled legislature's latest gerrymandered election maps did more than just silence voters in North Carolina. They reshaped the balance of power in Washington, D.C., costing Democrats control of the U.S. House of Representatives. And now, with Adam Gray's victory in California's 13th district giving Republicans a bare three-seat majority in the U.S. House, it's clear that gerrymandering in North Carolina tipped the scales in their favor and cost Democrats control of the U.S. House of Representatives.
Congressman Nickel did not run for re-election this year, citing his district as one of three in North Carolina that were vastly shaped by Republican gerrymandering. And Congressman Nickel joins us now.
JOE SCARBOROUGH: So, Congressman, Dave Wasserman brought this up about a week ago saying, you know, people don't understand, but a rigged map -- he didn't -- not his words, mine -- but a rigged gerrymandered map in North Carolina was the difference between Democrats controlling the House of Representatives for the next two years and Republicans. Of course, you can go back to 2022, and it was Democratic snafus in redistricting in New York state that actually put Republicans in charge. So, I'm just curious, how do we get past this gerrymandering? And how can states like yours actually reflect the will of the voters, the will of the people, and not the will of one party or the other like rigging the maps?
CONGRESSMAN WILEY NICKEL (D-NC): Well, thank you so much for having me. You know, the first point really important from that opinion piece is that Hakeem Jeffries ought to be the Speaker of the House right now. And if it wasn't for Republicans in North Carolina rigging the system for my seat and two others, Hakeem Jeffries would be the Speaker of the House. But the solution of course is we have to get partisan gerrymandering -- we have to take it away -- we have to let the voters choose the folks that represent them in Washington.
I have a bill for that -- the Fair Maps Act -- that would require nonpartisan independent redistricting in every state. But this is the thing that is wrecking Congress, and, in this case, it's cost Democrats control because of a rare, mid-decade gerrymander in North Carolina.
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But the fact is, Republicans do it much more than Democrats. It's wrong no matter who does it. But if you took -- look at the districts that are heavily gerrymandered -- North Carolina specifically -- where you get districts that don't represent the majority will of the state. North Carolina, again, a 50=50 state, 71 percent of the seats gong to Republcans because of extreme partisan gerrymandering.
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MSNBC's Deadline: White House
December 4, 2024
5:38 p.m. Eastern
NICOLLE WALLACE: So, come January 2025, it will be a one-seat majority for Speaker Mike Johnson. That's what he has to work with. But who does he have to thank for having that at all? Well, the Republicans in North Carolina because if it were not for the hyperpartisan gerrymander enacted by the Republicans in that state, he might not even be the Speaker. North Carolina voted for Donald Trump by a little over three percentage points this November, but it had three congressional seats flipped to the GOP as a result of the radical new Republican-leaning congressional map in that state. Which the Brennan Center describes this way, quote, "Along with Texas as one of the two most extreme congressional maps currently in place." Joining our conversation, voting rights attorney, founder of the site Democracy Docket, our friend Marc Elias is here. Tell us about North Carolina.
MARC ELIAS, DEMOCRACY DOCKET: Yeah, so, first of all, it's worth noting that Texas was also a Republican gerrymander. So both of the two states were gerrymandered by Republicans. But North Carolina is really a special case because, you know, North Carolina had engaged in an extreme partisan gerrymander before, and, as a result of a lawsuit that my law firm brought along with others. We struck that down as violating the state constitution banning partisan gerrymandering.
And what you had as a result was a fair map -- a map that was drawn that represented the diversity and the partisan balance of North Carolina. Well, what happened next is Republicans took control of the state supreme court, and, as soon as that happened, the legislature passed a new gerrymandered map -- a more extreme gerrymander than even before, ran that up to the state supreme court, and the state supreme court reversed the precedent that had just been set the year earlier, and said that, "Oh, no, no, no, partisan is just fine when Republicans do it."
And, to be clear, while it is true that Donald Trump won the state by three points, it is also true that a Democrat won the governorship and won some other statewide offices. So, you know, this is really a 50-50 state. And, you know, but yet you look at the map for Congress and you look at the state legislative map, and they are extreme Republican gerrymanders.
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WALLACE: So when we talk about gerrymandering, we're literally talking about choosing your voters, right? So they went in and they chose their voters, you know, stacking the deck, cheating basically. And I wonder how you -- especially in light of all the conversations we've had over the last four years -- how you make sure that no one looks away. I mean, we're in this razor-thin country -- the country appears to have voted in the mirror image of itself -- half for Trump, half for Harris -- a little more than half for Trump because he won the popular vote and the Electoral College -- but how do you make sure that what the Republicans are doing on the margins is not just countered legally by what you're doing, but people understand the effort and why they're doing what they're doing?
ELIAS: Yeah, so the first thing is we have to be talking about this constantly. You can't just talk about it in the years in which redistricting is done every 10 years. So the fact that we're talking about it today is really a testament to you and the importance of talking about this all the time and also talking about it as the practical consequence that it has for America. The second is, we need to make sure that people understand the facts. You know, one of the big lies that Republicans tell -- which, by the way, they're aided and abetted by far too many lazy people in the media because they say, "Well, everybody gerrymanders." Well, there are two states that don't gerrymander. How about California which has a citizen commission and New York which has a state constitutional provision that was put in place to prevent against partisan gerrymandering.
So what does that mean? It means that in Democratic-controlled states, we see this throughout the country -- they enact reforms to prevent against partisan gerrymandering. If you look at states like North Carolina or Ohio or Texas, you see Republicans do the opposite. In Ohio, Republicans defeated a ballot measure that would have prevented there partisan gerrymandering. But it is important that all parts of the media, you know, speak out about this -- year in, year out -- and talk about what the consequences are like here, the fact that Republicans will have control of the House rather than Democrats. And think about what the difference in accountability for Donald Trump would look like if Democrats had a one-seat majority.
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MSNBC's All In
December 4, 2024
8:46 p.m. Eastern
CHRIS HAYES: In fact, the only thing that stood between Democrats and an outright congressional majority in this election were the three seats that North Carolina Republicans flipped thanks to a gerrymandered map drawn up by the right-wing state legislature last year. Without that, Congress was looking at a Hakeem Jeffries Speakership.
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MSNBC's The Last Word
December 4, 2024
10:49 p.m. Eastern
LAWRENCE O'DONNELL: The final count of Republicans in the House later next year could go up to 220 versus 215. North Carolina Democratic Congressman Wiley Nickel believes gerrymandering in North Carolina prevented the Democrats from winning the House this time. He writes:
The Republican-controlled legislature's latest gerrymandered election maps did more than just silence voters in North Carolina. They reshaped the balance of power in Washington, D.C., costing Democrats control of the House of Representatives. They threw fairness out the window, forcing through a mid-decade map that handed Republicans an unfair 10-4 advantage in the next Congress. That's 71 percent of California's seats in the U.S. House going to Republicans.
My district along with the districts of Jeff Jackson and Kathy Manning were turned into safe Republican seats where Democrats had zero chance to win. Had North Carolina sent the three of us back to Washington, under fair maps, then New York Representative Hakeem Jeffries would be our next Speaker of the House with a one-seat Democratic majority at 218-217.
Joining our discussion now, Democratic Congressman Wiley Nickel of North Carolina. He's a former North Carolina state senator. Congressman Nickel, this is really a stunning turn in the effect of gerrymandering to actually have it end up deciding control of the House.
CONGRESSMAN WILEY NICKEL (D-NC): Absolutely. You know, Hakeem Jeffries ought to be Speaker right now. Democrats ought to have a seat at the table with Donald Trump, and that's what gerrymandering has cost our nation. It has literally changed the course of our nation's history. The three seats that Republicans gerrymandered with surgical precision in North Carolina are the difference in control of the next Congress. It's a big deal, and it is something that I think is that, when we're talking about this Congress, it's important to point out they don't have a mandate from the American public. They have a gerrymander that put them in power.
O'DONNELL: Yeah, this is the kind of thing that cannot happen in California, for example, the state with the most congressional districts, because they have taken redistricting out of politics and given it to an independent body to do it.
CONGRESSMAN NICKEL: Yeah, no, we've got to get the power to redraw maps out of the hands of politicians and have independent redistricting commissions. I have a bill for that. ...
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MSNBC's The Last Word
December 6, 2024
10:47 p.m. Eastern
JONATHAN CAPEHART: And North Carolina's Republican supermajority may have cost Democrats control of the United -- U.S. House when it passed a new gerrymandered redistricting map that redrew three competitive congressional districts represented by Democrats to bright red ones. Those three seats would have put the U.S. House seat count at 218 to Republicans' 217 and made Hakeem Jeffries Speaker.
